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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 2:39 pm 
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Okay,
What is the quad core Name and Number

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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2018 3:36 pm 
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Q9550S SLGAE- Intel Core 2 Quad 2.83 GHz

I did the fan reversal (back to OE pull thru) and turned around the fan in my furniture case. it is pulling air out as well (yes there is an unrestricted air inlet). CPU came down from 68 - 71 and I'm now the console is averaging 63 - 65 so that's progress. But considering that's also with the CPU at idle, I'm thinking it's still way too hot. I read the E6300 (also 65w TDP) idles at about 32 and gets into the 50's when converting videos. Problem is the E6300 literally benchmarks at half of the processing power.

On the other hand, both hard drives are now running hotter, 42 on the primary and 35 on the second. they were 40 and 32.

Fan speed is at 1500-1600. Not sure why the BIOS doesn't automatically ramp them up to full speed given the temps. They are set on Auto. But I do remember reading something about locking down the fans to full blast & disable the fan speed override (so they don't reset after a restart) in the bios.

On another note I installed speedfan on the server desktop to verify the temps the MSS console are reporting. It shows the temp of each individual core (now 65, 58, 60, 60) and the HDD temps match exactly. But the fans don't show up at all.. Very weird.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 11:09 am 
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the cpu needs to be under 60C to be reliable.
Did you use a good thermal paste on the cpu like arctic silver and follow directions.
It takes a few days for the paste to flow and needs a couple of load cycles meaning load then no load or shut down and restart after a bit.

I don't know what drives you have but as long as they stay under 60 c they should be okay also.
Almost every device drive, cpu, etc is rated for 60C max
But cooler is always better.

You can see the fan speed in the hp console under settings-mediasmart server tab general.
The only way to change the fan speeds manually is in bios.
The old fan speed addins only worked on the first few models like datavault, ex series above 475 will not work with it.

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The following user would like to thank Ruben Rocha for this post
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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 am 
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Just for the sake of argument I have a ex490 with a q9450s cpu and a wd red drive.
I modified the bios to run the fans faster.
Outdoor temp is 89f today
My server is in the garage unconditioned space.
The fan speed is 2660 rpm cpu is 57C and drive is 47C

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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 12:14 pm 
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My 2 cents:
I find that both the front "door" and the back wire mesh screen both do a great job :-( of collecting dust.
Some people remove the BACK screen mesh and then take the front door off or leave open. This is extreme, but having a Q?????S cpu in these servers is extreme.
Just having it in a cabinet or enclosed space is not a good thing even stock, especially if you live in the south.

I have found the E5800 to be an Great upgrade cpu, my server temps actully dropped a couple of degrees F because it was working less, I believe.
I did try the E8600 but that got a little to warm so went back.

But, I 2nd what "Ruben Rocha" said about keeping the system clean, Blasted out. I do this twice a year, pull all the drive (after I mark them) wipe everything down and then use a vacuum and air can blaster to make sure all the dust/bunnies are gone and then my servers are setting on an open rack and I vacuum the fronts of them weekly. Plus I have a Large air filter setting next to the rack to catch as much lint as I can before it gets to the servers.

Lastly, if you go to mod the settings in the bios for the fan, it is kind of complicated, I have not done it but have heard you have to trun off the default settings for the fans speed (or when you reboot they will go back to stock settings) then you have to tweak the settings of the fans which the settings are not in RPM or % what I hear. So might want to search for adjusting fan settings in the EX490/5 before you go in.

The Ex470 had a addin that would adjust the settings, but all the models after that you have to do in bios.
Hope this helps.
Good Luck and enjoy.
If you do mod the fan settings it would be nice to hear how you did it (steps) and how it's working for you.

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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 4:05 pm 
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Couple of observations:

Re harddrive temps:
The 2013 University of Virginia study of 10,000 hard drives in a Microsoft datacenter found that the annual failure rate steadily increases with temperature, from about 4% per year at 27 °C to about 10% per year at 44 °C (Figure 5). Assuming an Arrhenius equation, that gives twice the number of failures for every 12 °C increase in temperature. The study concludes that the annual failure rate steadly increases with temperature from about 2.75% per year at 40 °C to about 6% per year at 55 °C
↑ Sriram Sankar, Mark Shaw, Kushagra Vaid, Sudhanva Gurumurthi. "Datacenter Scale Evaluation of the Impact of Temperature on Hard Disk Drive Failures". [[3]] [doi: 10.1145/2491472.2491475]. 2013.

EX48x/49x BIOS Fan Settings:
viewtopic.php?f=25&t=11820&hilit=bios+fan+speed
viewtopic.php?f=25&t=14449&p=104345&hilit=bios+fan+speed#p104345


Dust Bunnies:
"Cleanliness is next to godliness"... John Wesley

CPU Temp / upgrade
E5800 is the Pentium chip standard in the Ex495, yes?

Below is a reference for three of the popular MSS CPU swaps based on standard desktop installs. Granted our passive install will be much warmer but this shows the expected differences between the three. Surprisingly the Q8200s only takes a 10% performance hit over the Q9550s but runs 15% cooler at idle & 20% cooler under load and benchmarks more or less similar to the E8400.

Core 2 Duo E8400 idle 26, Load 39, 50% temperature spread
Core 2 Quad Q8200s idle 27, Load 35, 29% temperature spread
Core 2 Quad Q9550s Idle 31, Load 43, 38% temperature spread

https://hothardware.com/reviews/intel-c ... ors?page=2

Also as reference I found the quote below in an old thread referencing the load temp on the E8400

s4mb4 wrote:
i bought an E8400 and put it in my EX490.
my temps have never exceeded 51C. the greatest thing is that AirVideo works again.
The celeron could not handle AirVideo.


Side note:
Do any of you guys happen to have a motherboard out of a MSS and could measure the mounting hole spacing on the heat sink? I think it may just be standard BTX (66mmx112mm). I'd like to play with the install of a copper base passive cooler or maybe even better, figure out an install of a low profile 92mm fan to sit on top of it.


Last edited by lioninstreet on Sat May 26, 2018 10:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 10:40 pm 
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Started the BIOS change on the fan speed by setting to run full speed as a start point.

Now idle on that q9550s is running in the range of 53, 49, 50, 50 to 50, 46, 47, 47. with the drive 0 at 38 and drive 1 at 35.

I'm looking harder at that q8200s in the hopes that I can end up with similar idle temps, load temps as shown above, and still be able to quiet (slow) the fans down.

Also as mentioned on my last post, do any of you guys happen to have a motherboard out of a MSS and be able to measure the mounting hole spacing on the heat sink? I think it may just be standard BTX (66mmx112mm). If that's what it is, I'd like to play with the install of a copper base passive cooler or maybe even better, figure out an install of a low profile 92mm fan to sit on top of it.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:39 pm 
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lioninstreet wrote:
Idle on that q9550s is running in the range of 53, 49, 50, 50 to 50, 46, 47, 47. with the drive 0 at 38 and drive 1 at 35.



Swapped in the Q8200s, No appreciable loss of performance. CPU temp down 6c - 8c. Drive temp down to 32c - 35c. Still at 100% fan use. Diving in to that next. Hoping I can quiet this thing down some without bringing temps up too much...


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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:23 pm 
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Again I will ask when swapping out the cpu's did you prep the cpu and heatsink correctly and apply thermal paste correctly.
arctic silver has a good tutorial.
Plus it takes several heat cycles to settle it.
Meaning heat up completely so everything is saturated with the temp. then power down and let it cool all the way.

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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:03 am 
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Hi Ruben,

Thanks for your concern. Yes I did clean and prep the CPU and heat sink using the proper procedure and cycled the processor several times before recording temps.

You might be interested to know that I started working with the fan slopes in an effort to reduce the fan noise. When returning the bios to the default settings (either standard or performance) from fans full on, the temps went back up considerably. I'm thinking that the temperature issue wont be really be properly addressed unless there is more efficient case cooling in play.

So in the effort to maximize hardware life, I'm probably going to add a 30mm fan in the front of the heat sink, but in an effort to limit fan noise I'm thinking I'll try to mount something on the front of the case cover first and plug it into the unused header on the board. Also the rear screening looks pretty restrictive and gathers dust super easy. So I'm planning a mod on that too.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2018 12:37 pm 
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All I can say is I tweaked the bios a bit using a q9450s. Meaning adjusting the slope and rise.
For people not in the know it is a pid algorithm.
Meaning proportional-integral- derivative calculation
Using wd red drives.
It is installed in my unconditioned space in the garage.
I live in central florida.
My fan speeds runs at 2697
My cpu temp is 56 C
My drive is 45 C
With my ambient temp at 92 F
Now they will climb a bit in the hottest month August.
I used arctic silver 5.
Since going to wd red drives I have not had a failure in several years.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:29 pm 
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After setting right the factory MSS case fans and seeing the dramatic results it made to the temps of the q9550s (from 68 - 71c to 63c - 65c) it made sense to spend some time seeking lower operating temperatures for my modified MSS.

As noted earlier, instead of working with the q9550s, I settled on the q8200s (still wanting to run a Q series CPU). Both are 65 TDP. On-line benchmarking in a standard computer showed it suffered a 10% performance hit, but it also ran quite a bit cooler. In the MSS the same held true, but in the server environment the performance hit wasn't noticeable. And, it runs at 56c. All with the case fans still running at 100%.

Changing the BIOS back to optimal settings, temps on the q8200s ran back up to 65c. So I glued a pair of 20dba 30mmx7mm Evercool fans together and placed them in front of the heat sink. The result, temps back to 55c - 56c.

Problem is the HDD's are still running hotter than ideal (in the high 30's, low 40's). If I could handle the fan noise, I'd probably just go back to the 100% fan settings in Bios to cool it all down a bit more. But that isn't the case.

Next is to better standardize the test results. So I'm starting to use Prime95 w/blend to do that. I'm planning to look for more efficient case fans, swap to a superior Xeon CPU that runs even cooler, play with the fan slopes in BIOS, and maybe custom fit a active copper 1u heatsink.

All this should help run MSS its fans on auto, get the loaded CPU temps into the high 40's, idle temps into the low 30's, and ultimately keep the MSS hardware running longer.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 10:38 am 
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Okay now we are on the drives.
What are they?
If they are 7200rpm. Then they are what they are,they will run hotter.
I had a wd black(7200rpm) as a os drive for a long time, it always was border line on temp.
Even after mucking with the fans in bios.
I finally took it out and replaced it with a wd red (5400 Rpm).
Never noticed a difference in performance , Boot time yes but not operations after boot.

Currently my ex490 power supply is failing.
The only way to get it to boot is unplug all the drives plus the two fans on the backplane.
Then push in the drives one at a time, Then after they spin up plug the fans back in.

But I have moved on to a readynas as a replacement.

I bought the ex490, however many years ago when it came out and it has served me well for a long time.
Upgraded the cpu as well as adding a debug board.
But at this point since I have migrated to a new platform. I don't think it is worth me re-powering the unit just to sell it.
So I am contemplating parting it out or throw it in the trash.
When I have time I will take it apart and see of I can repair it at a minimal cost.

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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 8:34 am 
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Hey Ruben,

I had the same failing PSU with a 47x PSU about 4 years into it's life. But it just crapped out. That you ran what, 7-8 years on your 490 is pretty good. Wasn't there something about HP changing the fan around on the 49x? Whatever they did it seemed to have worked.

And just to let you know, its says a lot that your still here on these threads offering advice considering you've pretty much moved on to the NAS.

On the drives I'm running, the unit has two of the WD Gold 2tb WD2005FBYZ (7200 rpm). With the rear fans running at 100%, no additional heat sink fans, and the Q8200s, temps were down at 33-35 on drive 0. But as soon as I set the bios back to optimal, 0 ran back up to 42c.

I then left the bios alone and added the 2 heat sink fans, HDD temps dropped slightly (2c-3c) but based on the report I referenced earlier in this thread, I think 39c-40c is still too hot.

Since Ive only got two drives at the moment, I wonder if the MSS would boot if I ran them staggered (running the OS drive in slot 0 and the data drive in slot 2)? At least there would be more airflow around drive 0 then.

And let me know if you decide not to fix your MSS. I've been toying with the idea of doing my testing on a spare instead of the unit I have all my data on. Maybe we could work something out.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU Temp kinda High
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 4:38 pm 
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Don't know other than they are 7200 rpm drives which in my experience they run very hot.
I am very happy with the wd reds at 5400rpm. I can't tell the difference in performance.
And they run a lot cooler.

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Q9450s CPU
Stock Ram
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Popcorn C-200
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Dune HD Connect
Rasberry PI OSMC(KODI)
ReadyNAs RN316


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