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PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2015 5:50 am 
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Sigh... I thought I knew what I was doing. Turns out, I wasn't :(

Upgraded HP MediaSmart Server EX490 (more RAM, new CPU)

System Disk: 1 TB with 20 GB SYS partition (a bit older) and (empty) DATA D:-partition for the remainder of the disk.

"my" Data Disks: 3x 2TB (newer disks) with LOTS of data.

Overnight I suddenly had some problems with downloading with emule (I use the NAS as a download location for all my PCs ++ I use it to backup all PCs).

Apparently, there were filesystem errors. Regular troubleshooting (chkdsk) did not solve anything.

I took out the primary disk, and did a Linux badblocks (full rewrite; 4 pass) on it. Indeed, some bad sectors were found but successfully wiped away in the last 3 passes.

So I then did repair and reset install procedures to reinstall WHS WITHOUT the 3x 2TB data disks (I did not want to risk a reset wiping it all...). Sadly, whatever I did, my 3 data disks remained unpartitioned in WHS console :(

Before wiping the primary disk, I made sure there was NO data on the EMPTY D:-partition (though I always wondered why it was called D: too, just like my 'real' 3x 2TB D:-drive volume...). I now know that the empty D:-drive indeed was part of the big extended drive created by microsoft. By Wiping the D:-partition on the primary disk, I had broken the Extended Drive Volume - the REAL D:-drive / volume!! ;-(

So now my question is... While no real data is lost (primary disk's D:-partition was empty), I cannot rebuild / find / reach my data... Surely the loss of a single disk shouldn't corrupt all my other data?? What's going on here? :s How to rebuild my WHS without formatting the 3x TB volume set?

ANY suggestions?? RAID data recovery software (still running) does not seem to understand this Drive Extender technology...

Thanks and peace!

Devnullius


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:03 am 
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Linux???
Are you using whsv1?
Anyway you should have used recovery not reset.
The safest way I know now for you.
Get your system drive working correctly.
Now the fun.
You either need one more blank 2tb drive for copying to or hopefully you have enough space to copy one of your pool drives to.

What you need to do is connect a pool drive to a pc, copy the data to a temp folder or drive.
You can view the data by turning on view hidden folders and files in windows explorer.
Then add the original drive to the server. Add a a pool drive and it will format it.
Then copy back from the temporary storage area to the server pool drive.
Rinse and repeat for each drive till complete.

There are multiple way to achieve this.

Bottom line is you wiped how the server knows they are pool drives.
So you need a way to add one drive to the server without data because the server will format the drive.

what you might be able to do is when you connect them to your pc.
One drive may only have a few gb of data that you pc has room for temporary storage.
I would start with that one first.
Then each additional pool drive you connect to the pc. you may have room on the server to copy them direct.
I would not enable file duplication on the server till done though. To preserve space to eliminate a additional copy process.

Also the first thing I would do after the system drive is done is install the smart addin so you will be warned upfront if there is a a bad drive. Or you will waste your time and need to start over again.
I would never rely on chkdsk 100%


This question has been asked so many times we need a detailed wiki to link to.

_________________
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Q9450s CPU
Stock Ram
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Popcorn C-200
Popcorn A-200
Dune HD Connect
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Amazon ECHO
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devnullius
PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:58 am 
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Well... I just have Windows :) Just used Linux badblocks to test and repair the drive.

After that I did repair and even reset (with 3x 2TB data unplugged), so booting the system is not the problem.

The problem is that (apparently) wiping the primary 1 TB disk (OS + Empty Data D) disk prevents me / the windows home server repair installation to re-enable the Extended Drive as a volume. All WHS now shows is 3 uninitialized disks... Initializing them means formatting them. Not gonna try that :)

As long as there is no partition structure for me to work with, I cannot find the hidden folder (I've read all about that, true, I even think it's a wiki already).

And yes, I'm already sighing because of the data backup when I reach the data after all... Another problem, for now. First I need to find the data :/

I don't know about a SMART plugin, but I had Acronis Drive Monitor installed - which warned me of cyclic errors. chkdsk is not smart to run when it comes to data recovery, but it was on my non-essential (or so I thought) system disk...

Windows Home Server Service Pack 3, 2009.
http://h20564.www2.hp.com/hpsc/doc/publ ... =c01764364
Windows Home Server Drive Extender: 6.0.2423.0


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2015 12:06 pm 
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Ok, making some progress but some feedback greatly appreciated...

Am I correct to assume that Microsoft's Drive Extender disks each should have their own (primary) partition.
Eg. if I'd rip out one of my 2TB disks and put them in another computer, should it show just a drive with part of my data on it?

If so... I should be able to get to my data by finding a partition recovery tool that (easily) fixes the primary partitions for all 3 2TB data disks...?

Because I'm now running a non-RAID data recovery on one of the disks and my folder tree structure comes floating by...

SO SHORT QUESTION: repair partitions for all 3 disks like they are regular windows disks.

Copy (merge) all data found on the 3 disks and backup it 'somewhere'? Re-initialize WHS Drive Extender (which will wipe my disks) and then put the backup back...?

Regards,

Devvie


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:27 pm 
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all you need to do is connect a data/pool drive to a pc.
in windows explorer enable the view for hidden files and folders.
then drill down to the folder that has the data.
It is view able and you can copy that back to a drive in the server.
Read my post again

No recovery tool should be needed or will work. you just use the standard copy/cut-move election.
In fact you can't use a recovery tool due to the windows registry assigns a unique name every time you add a pool drive.
Even if it is the same drive.
There is a way around this but it is very complicated and difficult.

If you had used recovery instead of reset we would not be talking now.

_________________
EX-490
WHS v1
VGA/PS2 Keyboard/PS2 Mouse/Serial debug board
Q9450s CPU
Stock Ram
ESATA Sansdigital Towerraid TR5M-B
Popcorn C-200
Popcorn A-200
Dune HD Connect
Rasberry PI OSMC(KODI)
ReadyNAS RN316
Amazon FireStick
Amazon ECHO
AnyDvD
MyMovies


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devnullius
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:31 am 
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Ok... Waking up... It might indeed be that WHS (or data recovery software installed on it) will not show drive letters (filesystem) because WHS 'blocks' it... So to my shame, I must admit... I assumed (maybe wrongly) no partitions were in place... :)

If I don't repost, you were absolutely right and I got it all moved to a new disk. Otherwise... ;p

Thank you! :) And sorry for all the mess if you turn out to be right - sometimes I overcomplicate stuff ;-)

devnullius


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:05 am 
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PS: "Data Deduplication" isn't something I should worry about? Trying to catch up here :)


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:13 am 
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if you turn on duplication first you will have less space to copy to until all the drives are added back.
Of course you have a risk till you turn it back on again.
If you are worried go ahead and turn it on but it may bark that you don't have enough storage space till you get all three installed.

Don't forget the sever will churn for a couple of days trying to duplicate all the files.
So it will run slow at first.

_________________
EX-490
WHS v1
VGA/PS2 Keyboard/PS2 Mouse/Serial debug board
Q9450s CPU
Stock Ram
ESATA Sansdigital Towerraid TR5M-B
Popcorn C-200
Popcorn A-200
Dune HD Connect
Rasberry PI OSMC(KODI)
ReadyNAS RN316
Amazon FireStick
Amazon ECHO
AnyDvD
MyMovies


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devnullius
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:11 am 
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devnullius wrote:
Ok... Waking up... It might indeed be that WHS (or data recovery software installed on it) will not show drive letters (filesystem) because WHS 'blocks' it... So to my shame, I must admit... I assumed (maybe wrongly) no partitions were in place... :)



Ok, I added one of the 3 2TB drives to my other PC (SATA to USB adapter). The drive is found, but again: NO drive letters or filesystem are detected... Which means I was right all along :(

I think this means I now have to do data recovery? :/

Devnullius


Post-edit, 20160308: got rid of my old mobo, replaced with a modern non-broken one and indeed now all partitions are there, including the DE folders. Copying them over the network is a pita, but working on it. Wish there was a way not to backup all data first. Gonna re-read this thread once more ;-)


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:52 pm 
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Being back on track; I now have 3 original 2TB disks, this time with the data visible on it (DE-folders).

If I have a data-pool with 6TB freespace, can I copy all data from all disks to the SAME destination? IF SO, what do I do with already existing files? I assume there will be duplicate files on the disks? If only for the DEguid.txt. OR should I make 3 separate folders on my 6TB data-pool and copy each disk to its own folder? And if I do it this way, won't I get duplicate files when copying them back to Windows Home Server?

Do I really need to rebuild my extended storage one drive at a time? I suppose not, right? And won't NTFS permissions become a problem for the new fresh Windows Home Server installation?

Peace :)

Devvie

Post-edit: note to self: READ THIS: https://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en- ... rum=whsfaq


Last edited by devnullius on Wed Mar 09, 2016 1:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2016 1:43 pm 
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Ruben Rocha wrote:
Then copy back from the temporary storage area to the server pool drive.
Rinse and repeat for each drive till complete.

This question has been asked so many times we need a detailed wiki to link to.


I probably make it more difficult than it is, but to avoid any mistakes... To prevent network copying, I'd like to do as you described, but once the disk is added (and formatted), power off the HP Homeserver. Take the disk out, and copy everything from backup disk to HS disk... Then plug the disk back into HS, boot it and my data will be there, right? Put differently; WHS doesn't need to be running to add data to the disks, right?

Peace!

Devnullius


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 1:05 pm 
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Ruben Rocha wrote:
Then copy back from the temporary storage area to the server pool drive.
Rinse and repeat for each drive till complete.


Or asked another way; Can I "copy back" by pulling the freshly formatted pool drive from the Powered Off HS, attach it to my 2nd PC with the data disk that has a copy of the original pool disk and copy it directly back? Then plug the pool drive back to the WHS and boot WHS? WHS will then autodetect the newly added data, correct?

Devnullius


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 1:28 pm 
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well it could work if you already added all the extra shared folders prior to a copy paste in the whs console.
And you place the files in the correct location.
Meaning don't create a primary shared folder outside of whs.

I really don't see a difference other than possibly some minor speed improvement for your method.

_________________
EX-490
WHS v1
VGA/PS2 Keyboard/PS2 Mouse/Serial debug board
Q9450s CPU
Stock Ram
ESATA Sansdigital Towerraid TR5M-B
Popcorn C-200
Popcorn A-200
Dune HD Connect
Rasberry PI OSMC(KODI)
ReadyNAS RN316
Amazon FireStick
Amazon ECHO
AnyDvD
MyMovies


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devnullius
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 3:04 pm 
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Ruben Rocha wrote:
well it could work if you already added all the extra shared folders prior to a copy paste in the whs console.
And you place the files in the correct location.

Good point, I was just about to start the process, but indeed, I did not think of this pesky detail :)

Ruben Rocha wrote:
Meaning don't create a primary shared folder outside of whs.

So all folders MUST be under the DE\Shares folders. Sigh. I was kinda hoping to directly share D:\ - this to prevent all kinds of problems due to too long file & path names (I had quite a few of them backing the data up).
What WOULD happen if I shared D:-directly... What features will I lose? The driver extender tech works outside the HP console scope, right? I'd love to hear more here... Post-edit: all my answers answered here: https://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en- ... hssoftware. Summary: don't do it. There is no web access to shared folders outside of WHS DE\shares folder. Also, no file duplication. For the last problem, there are other solutions, like installing a VPN or other remote access tool (ftp, ..., ...).

Ruben Rocha wrote:
I really don't see a difference other than possibly some minor speed improvement for your method.

BIG difference... It's slow like **** over the network. No fun at all. Now it (only) takes me 24 hours instead of 3 days :)
Though it brings me to yet another question: when overwriting the 'root'-folders of DE\shares\*, should I worry about NTFS permissions? Or can I safely overwrite my backup copy to it?

Thanks for taking time to help me, appreciated!

Devvie


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:03 pm 
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devnullius wrote:
Ruben Rocha wrote:
well it could work if you already added all the extra shared folders prior to a copy paste in the whs console.
And you place the files in the correct location.

Good point, I was just about to start the process, but indeed, I did not think of this pesky detail :)

Ruben Rocha wrote:
Meaning don't create a primary shared folder outside of whs.

So all folders MUST be under the DE\Shares folders. Sigh. I was kinda hoping to directly share D:\ - this to prevent all kinds of problems due to too long file & path names (I had quite a few of them backing the data up).
<knip>
Thanks for taking time to help me, appreciated!


WTF!!! I did as I said. AND MY DATA DISAPPEARED! It took WHS about 15 minutes to boot after I placed the disks back. I don't know WTF it had been doing, but all my shared folders were on the disks. Shared and all. I even created a share "sdfdslfsdf" just to double check. The Share folder did not contain all folders (eg. 1 disk had Shared\Software, the other did not - when a folder was missing I created it. Both disks had the "sdlfsdfdsf" folders. Then I powered on WHS and guess what... EVERYTHING IS GONE! WHERE DID IT GO?? DID WHS JUST REMOVE ALL FOLDERS IN THE ROOT? For strangely enough, when I attached the disks to my backup PC, I found the shared & folders folders not in the X:\DE\Shares folders, but in D:\shares. I double checked, but there it was and that's where I copied all my files... To D:\shares. Suspecting that might not be correct (despite the "sdfdsfsdsd" test folder), I thought to fix that later. SO WHY DID WHS REMOVE ALL MY DATA IN D:\Shares????? ;-( ;-(


The following was originally in my last post, I had to remove it:
"IF (like I'm planning to) you don't need file replication for data redundancy (because you will be backing up WHS itself to yet another server), and IF you don't mind (or even like... extra security!) you can't use xxx.homeserver.com to access your files... THEN and ONLY then you may make shared folders outside of the WHS gui (with remote desktop login to your WHS). " --> THIS WILL DESTROY YOUR DATA!!!!!


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