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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 6:15 am 
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Cavediver,
Any ideas why some of us are having trouble with data from SASLP cards???

Also, when I try and run either Speedfan or HDSentinel on my server...the server locks up and needs to be restarted. Any Ideas?


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:02 pm 
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Silhouette wrote:
Cavediver,
Any ideas why some of us are having trouble with data from SASLP cards???


This is just pure speculation on my part, but I've suspected that the problem may lie in the mobo's pcie slots. As you may or may not know, not all mobo pcie slots work as advertised. An x16 slot may only be actually x8, an x8 slot may be only x4 and an x4 slot may be only x1. Also, the actual x# of a particular slot may change based on what cards are populating the other slots. The SASLP cards are x4 cards and if they are in a slot that doesn't actually produce x4, then the card may not be able to pass the SMART data.

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Also, when I try and run either Speedfan or HDSentinel on my server...the server locks up and needs to be restarted. Any Ideas?


Sorry. No ideas.


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 8:57 pm 
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Hey Cavediver


I have followed your build from the beginning and in reading your build, i have too put together a Norco. I used parts from another case as it did not have enough room for drives with 8 not being enough. Although i do have my Norco ( No name for it yet like Andromeda, any suggestions for a name i would love to hear ) up and running i have run out of room for expansion with my current MB.

I use a Asus MB ( not sure on the model number off hand could check it needed ) i use 1 SM card though it is not like yours and uses the Reverse Breakout Cables with the 8 Sata ports. My MB will not work correct when i try to use both the SM card and the MB's Sata ports. So the rebuild time has come as i have 2 rows on the Norco filled but would love to upgrade it to handle multiple drives as your system does.

I have put together a list but did not want to pull the trigger till i get some input as i want this to be a stable system and go with what works and is proven and who better to ask than you. You also made it possible for all of us that has built a Norco to be able to live in the same house with it. Those stock Delta's are out of control. You fan board has made me go from wanting to get rid of the Norco to being very happy i switched cases in the first place

Heres the question if you were going to rebuild Andromeda or to someone like myself what would you suggest. Here is the list i came up with so far. Please let me know any tweaks you suggest and if so why.

Motherboard- GIGABYTE GA-EP45T-USB3P LGA 775 Intel P45 USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard ( I picked this board since it would give me the ability to add another Norco down the road if i ever needed that much room )

Power Supply - CORSAIR HX Series CMPSU-750HX 750W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS SILVER Certified Modular ( Seems to be the same as the one you use and you do not have a problem powering all your drives. Also like the fact that it is Modular to cut down on case clutter ! )

Processor - Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80570E8400 ( Not sure on this pick but it was suggested for the rebuild from another member on AVS )

Memory - G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory

OS Drive - Western Digital Scorpio Black WD3200BEKT 320GB 7200 RPM 2.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Internal Notebook Hard Drive ( Not sure if i should take the cost on a SSD. I just use this to watch Blu Rays and maybe surf the web once in a while since i use my Laptop for everything else and surfing the web )

OS - Win 7 ( Do not know too much about Windows Server. I use JBOD and do not know if i would gain anything running JBOD and Window Server. Then again i do not know much about Windows Server. Could i even still surf the net with Windows Server ? )

Hard Drive Controllers - I have a Supermicro Card just not the same as yours. It uses the 8 Sata ports instead. So i am sure i would need another one of these. Though i am open to your thoughts of me changes to the cards you use. As i said it would cut down on Case clutter and you seem to have no issues with yours.

Like i said, i am shooting for having 20+ drives. I want to start by filling up my Norco first. I have 2 rows filled with only 1 free drive left and many more Blu Rays i can think of.... Any and all help from you and anyone else would be greatly appreciated !

Thanks !


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:31 pm 
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I don't know anything about that mobo, but everything else looks ok. You just need to make sure you have enough pci and pcie slots for a good graphics card, a good Intel NIC and drive expansion. The Supermicro MV8 cards are fine for WHS and seem to work with just about anything. To fill up the Norco 4220 you will need 2 of the MV8s (16 drives), and 5 or 6 mobo sata ports. Four to fill up the last 4 drive bays, 1 for the OS drive and maybe 1 for a dvd or blu-ray drive.

For future expansion, you can consider the HP SAS expander if you have an extra pci slot.

If I were building now, I'd use a Supermicro mobo and a low power Xeon cpu. While the i3 or i5 CPUs are great low power CPUs, the 1156 mobos have limited pcie bandwidth which limits expansion options.


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sat Jun 26, 2010 5:23 pm 
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Any reason why you may think that i can not use my MB Sata ports on my setup now ? I have 1 SM card and i use that for 8 drives and it works great. I use sata 1 port on my MB to do my 2.5 OS drive. It still leaves me with 4 Sata's to run another row of drives but i have a boot problem every time i try to run both the SM card and the MB ports at the same time. When i did try it i did not have the SM card filled yet so i do not know if that had any problem with why it would not work right.


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sat Jun 26, 2010 5:58 pm 
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keithkeith3333 wrote:
Any reason why you may think that i can not use my MB Sata ports on my setup now ? I have 1 SM card and i use that for 8 drives and it works great. I use sata 1 port on my MB to do my 2.5 OS drive. It still leaves me with 4 Sata's to run another row of drives but i have a boot problem every time i try to run both the SM card and the MB ports at the same time. When i did try it i did not have the SM card filled yet so i do not know if that had any problem with why it would not work right.


What is your problem with running both at the same time? Does it just sit there and not find a bootable drive? When I have had problems it was always with the sequence of drives, most motherboards will only show a a limited number of drives and if the boot drive is not in the right sequence it will not look for it. Look at your boot sequence in the bios and make sure the boot drive is the first one.

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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 12:02 am 
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erail wrote:
keithkeith3333 wrote:
Any reason why you may think that i can not use my MB Sata ports on my setup now ? I have 1 SM card and i use that for 8 drives and it works great. I use sata 1 port on my MB to do my 2.5 OS drive. It still leaves me with 4 Sata's to run another row of drives but i have a boot problem every time i try to run both the SM card and the MB ports at the same time. When i did try it i did not have the SM card filled yet so i do not know if that had any problem with why it would not work right.


What is your problem with running both at the same time? Does it just sit there and not find a bootable drive? When I have had problems it was always with the sequence of drives, most motherboards will only show a a limited number of drives and if the boot drive is not in the right sequence it will not look for it. Look at your boot sequence in the bios and make sure the boot drive is the first one.



Ya it just will not find the boot drive. I have made sure that i have my 2.5 drive as the boot drive and it is at the top in the boot sequence. Still when it tries to load up it will say if i am not mistaken since it was a few months ago that i last tried to get it to work, gave me a message could not load boot drive or something to that sort. I did not have my SM card filled when i last tried and i think i remember someone saying they had a problem with that with not having their SM card in full use. It would cause it not to load it and the Satas on the MB. I am not sure. I am still very new to this as it was my first build. Still learning from much reading on this site as well as AVS. If i could just buy a new Power Supply and another SM card, i could run a 3rd row of drives on the Norco and that would hold me over for a while till i change out everything and take the old parts to make a unit for the bedroom to stream.
So any ideas where i may be going wrong ?

Also would i benefit from using Windows Server ? Do i still use Windows 7 with it ? I use Vista now and have no issues. I run JBOD as well if that helps. Thanks again for the help !


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 5:54 am 
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If you're using the SASLP card, you will need to disable INT13 in the card's bios. With INT13 enabled, the system may try to boot off of a drive on the card. I don't know if the same applies to the MV8 cards.


Last edited by cavediver on Sun Jun 27, 2010 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 8:10 am 
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I can not remember which one is the card i have. I have the SM card that has the sata outputs that i use reverse breakout cables with. I never knew about the cards with the 2 SAS outputs till after i bought the other one. It would be nice to use the one with the SAS since it would cut down on clutter. I do not have room on my MB for another card though since i use the 5750 and it blocks the other slot for another card

What is INT13 ? Will it change anything else on my system disabling that ? Ive never been to the bios of the card. Just familiar with getting the boot sequence right. I believe the MB that i want to use in my rebuild that i had listed in a post above will let me run 2 of the SM cards, my 5750 and still have room to run another Norco down the road. Still learning though. I know to play big you have to pay big ! What would you recommend ? You had also said to get a good Intel NIC. What is the purpose of the NIC since i have never used one ?

Thanks again......

Also with all those drives you have, how many blu rays do you have ripped ? ? ?


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 8:39 am 
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MV8's require PCI-X slots, if you are using express slots you are not using MV8s and MV8s don't use init13. However, motherboards are sensitive to boot sequence. Usually at boot time, you can go into the boot menu to see what the sequence actually is by hitting F12 or F11. Most motherboards with more than 4 sata ports have 2 channels and if you get the boot drive on the secondary channel with a lot of drives it will not find the boot drive even though you may have it ok in the bios boot sequence. You success may vary depending on the motherboad and manufacturer. Cavediver is correct with disabling init13 because it will try to boot off the card and then you just have too many drives for it to find the correct one. Disabling init13 has no effect on the rest of the system.

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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 10:30 am 
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@Erail,

There might be some confusion. The MV8 ending is used on at least two products from SuperMicro.
AOC-SATA-MV8 is PCI-X
http://www.supermicro.com/products/acce ... T2-MV8.cfm

AOC-SASLP-MV8 is PCIe x4
http://www.supermicro.com/products/acce ... LP-MV8.cfm

As mentioned by Cavediver, the SASLP-MV8 does have the option to turn off INT13 and that model is PCIe x4.


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 12:06 pm 
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erail wrote:
MV8's require PCI-X slots, if you are using express slots you are not using MV8s and MV8s don't use init13. However, motherboards are sensitive to boot sequence. Usually at boot time, you can go into the boot menu to see what the sequence actually is by hitting F12 or F11. Most motherboards with more than 4 sata ports have 2 channels and if you get the boot drive on the secondary channel with a lot of drives it will not find the boot drive even though you may have it ok in the bios boot sequence. You success may vary depending on the motherboad and manufacturer. Cavediver is correct with disabling init13 because it will try to boot off the card and then you just have too many drives for it to find the correct one. Disabling init13 has no effect on the rest of the system.



Ya i mean i am now running the SM card for the first 2 rows of my Norco. Then i have Sata 1 from my MB going to my 2.5 OS drive. It will boot and run beautiful. Now if i take the remaining 4 Sata ports i have on my MB and run that for another row, it will give me the cant find boot drive message. Now i stated before when i last tried this, my SM card was only half used. Only had 4 drives running off it. Do not know if that had anything to do with it or if i should get different results now that the SM card i have is fully loaded with 8 drives. I would love to add another SM card but i can not since the 5750 is blocking the other slot for another one. I could run my 3rd row for the Norco with the remaining Sata ports on the MB if it will allow me to do it. Is there a way to have it not go onto a secondary channel ?

Does the rebuild list i posted above look to be good ? Cavediver said everything looked good but he was not familiar with the MB i picked. Just would love anyones input on it. Trying to stay with what is proven and works !

Thanks again !


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 12:34 pm 
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Yes, it sounds like when you add the motherboard sata ports, the sata port you have the system drive attached to falls off the search list. My guess is your motherboard has a limited amount of drives it will search and when you add the other drives to the system it will not find the system drive. If you have 2 separate controllers on the motherboard or you did not disable the init13 on the SAS-MV8 this problem can occur. A good way to check is look at the Diskmanager add-in paths and make sure your system drive is on the 0 controller and not on the 1 controller. If your IDE controllers are enabled and you have no drives on them, make sure you disable.

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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2010 9:02 pm 
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Ya i do not have the SAS-MV8 though. I use the AOC-SAT2-MV8. The SAS version would have been nice for the less Case Clutter but i was still new and ordered the AOC-SAT2-MV8 instead. Works great. Just does not like working with the Sata ports on the MB and uses a PCI slot. Just want to get to a fully loaded Norco. I do know that i need to upgrade most of my parts to do so though.


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 Post subject: Re: Andromeda
PostPosted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:26 am 
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I use SAT2-MV8's and have had no problems with motherboard ports but the sequence of drives can be very touchy which will result in your exact problem. A lot depends how the motherboard reads the PCI slots in sequence(up or down) and what channels your motherboard uses. I have found you move the system drive to what ever channel is used first by the motherboard. It doesn't have anything to do with whether the SAT2 is full or not. You do realize that using the SAT2 cards in PCI slots vs PCI-X slots will slow access. PCI-X slots will run at 133mhz vs PCI slots at 33mhz.

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